Cloning the MicroMac MMXL99 LC-LCII-CC

[aperezbios]

Has anyone (@Bolle ?) Looked in to cloning this board? I have one I am willing to sacrifice to the cause. Looks like they made one pcb for either 030 or 020 upgrades, and the only active component is a GAL22V10B, for which there is a modern available alternative, the ATF22V10C, which is a sub-$3 component.

 

[max1zzz]

That's only a 4 layer board, it would be insanely easy to reverse engineer that PCB

The issue with that GAL is that it contains code, It could be unprotected and my just be able to be read out, but likely it has the code protect bit set and will need some significant effort to either extract the code or reproduce it from scratch

I could clone that board easily, but if the GAL is protected reverse engineering that is beyond my skillset

 

[olePigeon]

If you're going through the effort to extract GALs and PALs and whatnot, might as well set your sights on the Presto Plus.

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

The issue with that GAL is that it contains code, It could be unprotected and my just be able to be read out, but likely it has the code protect bit set and will need some significant effort to either extract the code or reproduce it from scratch

@Bolle has an automagical gizmo that makes reading some protected GAL types doable, but some types are not. Don't remember specifics, but I think it's mostly the DIP series types that would be problematic?

Performer for the compacts is easy enough, don't know about this one, but it'd be a first step step toward PerformarPlus. Comparing that 68020 interface to 68000 IC/SE PDS Performer would be an interesting project in itself. It may be as simple as buzzing the traces for function to see how the interface might be different and working with the 68000 formulas if that GAL refuses to yield its secrets.

 

[demik]

22V10s are more difficult to dump. If its simple combinational that could be easy, if it's registered or other complex thing it will need a dump, which may not be possible if it's registered.

Can you trace where the pin1 of the GAL go ?

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

I researched cloning the Perforner for 68000 Macs with hopes of doing a few crazy projects with it a few years back. Pretty sure you'll find some useful info there:

MicroMac Performer Redux: Cloning a 68030 Accelerator for Compact Macs

This one is mine, it came as wonderful surprise in my Drexel 128K that had been upgraded to Plus and then to "4MB SE/30" status over the course its remarkably extended useful lifetime. Not one of the original, silk screened student versions we've come to appreciate, but a killer machine from the...

68kmla.org

 

[max1zzz]

@aperezbios did anyone ever take up your offer on this?

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

max, is that GAL22V10B in DIP package on the crackable list? If its not, I'll bet @Bolle can figure out what it's doing.

 

[Bolle]

I had some success cracking 22V10s lately - couldn't figure out yet how to reproduce the results of the method I used consistently.
Yet again it seems to be at least somewhat specific to the exact chip type/speed rating.

 

[max1zzz]

max, is that GAL22V10B in DIP package on the crackable list? If its not, I'll bet @Bolle can figure out what it's doing.

Yeah it is which is why I thought of this again

I had some success cracking 22V10s lately - couldn't figure out yet how to reproduce the results of the method I used consistently.
Yet again it seems to be at least somewhat specific to the exact chip type/speed rating.

I would be interested it throwing a 22V10 at a gal cracking gizmo I built one of recently and seeing if it's any good at breaking them (it seems to be very effective at cracking 16v8's, I have had mixed success with 20V8's though (and don't have any 22v10 to test it with))

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Sweet, another great project may be in the works!

 

[mg.man]

...it seems to be very effective at cracking 16v8's

Perhaps we need to start a new thread on this... but I did just get my grubby little hands on one of these...

 

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Nice! Get one started ASAP.

 

[max1zzz]

Perhaps we need to start a new thread on this... but I did just get my grubby little hands on one of these...

View attachment 40107

View attachment 40108

Oooh, well if you want that cloned feel free to send that my way

 

[mg.man]

Get one started ASAP.

Cloning the Interware Booster 30

As mentioned in the "Cloning the MicroMac MMXL99 LC-LCII-CC" thread... I have just picked up one of these little beauties, which seems to have one of the more crack-able GALs: There's not much info out there on the 'web about it... @max1zzz, @Bolle, have either of you looked into cloning...

68kmla.org

 

[mg.man]

if you want that cloned feel free to send that my way

Why would I do that? I already have one.... Let's pick up in the other thread I just created...

 

[dr.zeissler]

sorry to bother you, one short question. Do these upgrade-boards run with MacOS 6.0.8. ?

 

[Siliconinsider]

Got these two from a scrapper, so yay for cloning!!!

 

[max1zzz]

Ooh nice, looks like the red one is more or less the same design as the one @aperezbios has just in a differen't form factor and looks like it would be a "simple" job

The green one would more tricky as it has a PAL on it which is not vulnerable to the "glitching" trick (And will in fact be instantly destroyed if you even try it form what I have read!) though I am interested by what it is going with that MT SRAM.....

 

[Siliconinsider]

The RAM is actually 16k of cache (MT is cache and IDT is for TAG)