Bluetooth EDR + PowerPC = ?

[ChadVDR]

I see that the last run of PowerPC Mac’s were fitted with BT 2.0+EDR. Why?

Ok, I know it’s for nearby data transfer like iSync, sharing contacts, or even using it as a headset for iChat, but thinking back to that era (with the understanding that my memory can be dubious) I seem to recall the EDR marketing point was that now you could play high quality music over the air!

Tiger clearly did not have this support built-in, but with the arrival of Leopard you can indeed choose to designate a Bluetooth device as “headphones” rather than “headset”.

Here’s the behavior of both:

Headset: playing audio sounds like a phone call. Very limited bandwidth and frequency range. Maybe mono?

Headphones: audio is high quality but choppy like trying to listen to satellite radio under an overpass or as if you’ve walked too far away from your device.

What is the limitation here? Is the OS not intended for this purpose, is it a bottleneck in the old architecture, or just the 2.0 EDR chips that Apple chose?

If it’s a performance constraint from the architecture, how does a workhorse like the G5 Quad handle this job?

 

[akator70]

I had disappointing experiences with Bluetooth audio on all Macs PPC and Intel. They would pair but inevitably lose the connection and have difficulty pairing again. This spans all of the Macs and different Bluetooth audio devices I've owned from 2006 until now. I've rarely had issues with Linux, Windows, Android, or iOS with the exact same audio devices that I have experienced issues in Mac OS X / macOS.

I don't think this was from hardware because I used Linux on some of the older Macs and didn't experience the same Bluetooth audio problems. I'm no expert, nor do I play one on TV, but I'm guessing there's something up with the macOS Bluetooth audio drivers.

When I finally got an Apple Silicon Mac the Bluetooth audio issues disappeared.

 

[ChadVDR]

@akator70 that sounds odd. My experience has been generally good except when it comes to certain devices. I had JBL headphones that were flawless and replaced them when they broke. New JBL model…oh the issues. They’d barely stay connected before I’d have to go into Settings and re-select them as my audio out destination. Dumb bug. Somehow it has to do with the specific headphones because it wasn’t a problem before.

My dissatisfaction with these old Mac’s is specifically the performance and not so much connectivity or “bugs”. It’s just the fact that no G4 (mini, PowerBook) seems to be able to play quality audio to my headphones.

 

[akator70]

Perhaps the alien implant in my skull is emitting a frequency that is competing with Mac Bluetooth audio connections.

Jokes aside, I wonder if this is caused by the "Low Energy" features in Bluetooth 4+ client devices communicating older Bluetooth that doesn't fully support newer features. IIRC, I encountered the same thing when using a Bluetooth 2.1 + EDR USB adapter with Bluetooth 4.x headphones. When I bought a new Bluetooth USB adapter the issues disappeared. I've got a Bluetooth 4 USB adapter on a USB hub with my G4 iMac (it didn't have Bluetooth built-in) and that works well enough that all other devices in my household see that iMac when searching for new devices.

 

[adespoton]

I see that the last run of PowerPC Mac’s were fitted with BT 2.0+EDR. Why?

...

What is the limitation here? Is the OS not intended for this purpose, is it a bottleneck in the old architecture, or just the 2.0 EDR chips that Apple chose?

If it’s a performance constraint from the architecture, how does a workhorse like the G5 Quad handle this job?

I had a G5 iMac running 10.4/10.5. The limitation was the 2.0 EDR. The quality meant I just didn't bother with Bluetooth at all -- both on that and on the Core2Duo iMac I replaced it with in 2009, which also had horrible EDR. This problem had gone away by 2015, but was present in all the Core2Duo generation.

 

[Dandu]

I see that the last run of PowerPC Mac’s were fitted with BT 2.0+EDR. Why?

Ok, I know it’s for nearby data transfer like iSync, sharing contacts, or even using it as a headset for iChat, but thinking back to that era (with the understanding that my memory can be dubious) I seem to recall the EDR marketing point was that now you could play high quality music over the air!

Tiger clearly did not have this support built-in, but with the arrival of Leopard you can indeed choose to designate a Bluetooth device as “headphones” rather than “headset”.

Here’s the behavior of both:

Headset: playing audio sounds like a phone call. Very limited bandwidth and frequency range. Maybe mono?

Headphones: audio is high quality but choppy like trying to listen to satellite radio under an overpass or as if you’ve walked too far away from your device.

What is the limitation here? Is the OS not intended for this purpose, is it a bottleneck in the old architecture, or just the 2.0 EDR chips that Apple chose?

If it’s a performance constraint from the architecture, how does a workhorse like the G5 Quad handle this job?

It's not really the + EDR the problem, here.

With Tiger, the profile used is the HFP (Hands-Free Profile) or the HSP (Headset Profile). The sound is bad because it's compressed with ADPCM and a very low bitrate (64 kb/s). It's mono ~8 Hz (in a band optimised for voice).

Leopard use the A2DP profile. It's optimised for music, with a compression like MP3, named SBC. The bitrate is generaly low (under 200 kb/s) and SBC is not a good codec.

The limitation is a mix : many old Mac only have old and slow Bluetooth chips, and slow CPU. With A2DP and Leopard, the CPU compress audio in realtime, and it's CPU intensive with an old G4 (not really a problem with Intel CPU).

I think there is software to use A2DP with Tiger, but it's old and not a good idea if you have not a fast CPU.

 

[ChadVDR]

Leopard use the A2DP profile.

That’s the one!

Now my brain is computing properly.

I thought it was EDR that was all the rave all those years ago but it is for certain A2DP. This was when boomboxes and car stereos etc started advertising this feature heavily.

To know that even the first generation of Intel machines couldn’t even handle playing audio over Bluetooth sure makes me feel old. I feel like in 2006 if somebody told me that they had wireless headphones that paired with their laptop, I wouldn’t have been surprised. Maybe my contextualization isn’t great.

I’ll have to try Leopard on some of my Mac’s. Thank you!

@adespoton I have a quad core G5. If that can’t handle it then it’s game over