Apple Talk Trouble...

[OrganistAnthony]

Greetings All,

I'm new to the forum and have been appreciating all of the wonderful posts!

I'm trying to share files between a Powerbook G3 PDQ running OS 9.2 with a Performa 575 (without ethernet) running 7.5.3 with a serial cable. I've filled in the necessary name, password, computer name, etc., turned on file sharing and AppleTalk, set up some shared folders, and tried to select the proper ports on both sides. I can't get the computers to see each in the chooser. I've fiddled enough with the settings that I'm starting to wonder if it's the cord, a recently purchased new, legacy serial cable from Cable Wholesale.

I would appreciate any insight all of you may have, perhaps I'm missing something obvious. Thank you so much for your time!

 

[cheesestraws]

If double-checking the ports and checking that AppleTalk is enabled on both sides shows nothing, it could be the wire. I do have a serial cable here that will do RS232 but not LocalTalk but which looks identical to first-party Apple ones.

 

[mdeverhart]

Unfortunately, there are two types of serial cables commonly used with classic Macs. “Modem” cables are wired straight through, while “printer” cables are wired as cross-over/null-modem, with TX and RX swapped (so that TX on one end goes to RX on the other end, and vice versa). Connecting two Macs back-to-back for LocalTalk requires the cross-over style cable. I’d guess that’s your issue - most of the modern Mini DIN-8 cables I’ve seen are wired straight through.

If you have a multi-meter handy you can check how they’re wired, if it’s pin 1 to pin 1, 2 to 2, etc. then you have a straight through cable. You’ll need to either find one wired as cross-over, or cut the cable and re-wire it. This page has a picture showing how it should be wired (last picture in the page):

https://macgui.com/upload/gallery/f_0/user_2/regular/upload_4705.png

 

[mikes-macs]

So this Powerbook G3 has a Printer/Modem Port? If not I guess you're trying to do USB to serial?

If the Powerbook does have a Printer/Modem Port and you're using a "Printer" cable as mdeverhart suggested then your problem is that you need to use the AppleTalk Control Panel on each machine to select the desired port to be used for AppleTalk. Assuming each machine has the "Printer cable plugged into the Printer Port, select "Printer Port". If the cable is plugged into the the "Modem" Ports then select "Modem" Port. I have a feeling the Powerbook is set to use Ethernet or perhaps WIFI as perhaps that was last port used to connect to something else, perviously. On the Performa 575 if you do not have OpenTransport installed you won't see and AppleTalk control panel. In this case you'll be switching the AppleTalk Port using the "Network" control Panel instead. There you'll probably only see one option. "LocalTalk". Selecting that will use the Printer Port by default. You can select the printer port on one machine and the modem port on the other but just make sure each one has AppleTalk active on the port with the cable inserted..

In the event that the Powerbook does not have a Printer or Modem port and you are using USB to serial adapter then you have to make sure you are using the correct USB to Serial adapter as suggested by cheesestraws. There are some that just don't do AppleTalk. There's more info on USB to Serial adapters in these forums.

 

[OrganistAnthony]

Thank you to everyone for the networking and cable insight. I can now confirm that the cable was the problem. I tried another new cable, Lindy brand, that was described as both a printer and PowerTalk cable. I'm successfully sharing files between my Powerbook G3 (PDQ) from the printer/modem port to my Performa 575 printer port.

 

[cheesestraws]

Glad to hear that's working for you now

 

[mdeverhart]

Great, glad it’s working!

 

[9166188]

In the context of using AppleShare (NOT terminal style serial connection), can two vintage Macs AppleTalk to each other thru a Min-Din-8 crossed-over cable? This means one can get away w/ using any connector boxes? I know u need these boxes when say networking more than two Macs, but not sure between just two. Can anyone confirm?

I also like to ask in the case of between two connector boxes, the Mini-Din-3 cables should be straight through (NOT crossed), right? Asked because I like to make my own cables.

 

[treellama]

Yes, they can talk fine using a “printer” cable, which is mini DIN-8 crossover.

 

[cheesestraws]

the Mini-Din-3 cables should be straight through (NOT crossed), right

Correct Note, though, that the connectors on the LocalTalk boxes are slightly too deep/narrow for some current model Mini DIN plugs (or the barrels on those plugs are slightly too wide, depending on how you look at it. Ask me about the extremely annoying way I found this out.

 

[9166188]

Correct Note, though, that the connectors on the LocalTalk boxes are slightly too deep/narrow for some current model Mini DIN plugs (or the barrels on those plugs are slightly too wide, depending on how you look at it. Ask me about the extremely annoying way I found this out.

Thanks! Let me find out if this will be another annoying experience. My guess is that it always looks easy until one tries.

BTW, had u tried open a connector box successfully without breaking it? It has no screws and I dare not to force it through.

 

[9166188]

Yes, they can talk fine using a “printer” cable, which is mini DIN-8 crossover.

I was under a false impression that one needs those connector boxes to use AppleTalk. Now, MD-8 is really a variant of RS232. Good to know!

 

[9166188]

Well, confused again! I thought between two connector boxes is a mini-din-3 cable. But this connector kit package suggests it's a mini-din-8 (NOT mini-din-3)?

 

[Iesca]

Well, confused again! I thought between two connector boxes is a mini-din-3 cable. But this connector kit package suggests it's a mini-din-8 (NOT mini-din-3)?

That is poorly labelled methinks; I think it's referring to the whole setup rather than just the (mini din-3) cable that connects the boxes.

 

[cheesestraws]

Well, confused again! I thought between two connector boxes is a mini-din-3 cable. But this connector kit package suggests it's a mini-din-8 (NOT mini-din-3)?

That is poorly labelled methinks; I think it's referring to the whole setup rather than just the (mini din-3) cable that connects the boxes.

Agreed. It's definitely mini DIN-3 between the boxes. That is referring to the fact the boxes are mini DIN-8 boxes, I think, as opposed to the 9-pin D boxes for the 128/512

 

[9166188]

Got it! Readily makes sense to something doesn't.