Garrett's Finds

Finally made it back from classes/work to sit down and play around some more with the "SuperSE." This thing is loaded with old software and files... I'll have to make a backup and make sure none are missing from Macintosh Garden/Macintosh Repository/etc.

There is some slight screen burn-in on the SE. But the display seems to be fairly crisp otherwise.

The Kensington System Saver, as I mention (but you can't really hear) in the video in my post above, is a little on the loud side. It makes an ominous rattling/rumbling sound after it gets going for a couple minutes, then it quits and is pretty quiet.

Files present on the machine give the impression it was used from 1988 to 1995/96.

Edit: Does anyone know how to permanently disable/remove the password extension thing? I'd like for it to boot normally with all extensions, but don't know the password. They had top-notch security back in the day... almost reminds me of the locked gates that have a giant space next to them that allow you to fit your hand through to unlock and enter.

Garrett said:

Finally made it back from classes/work to sit down and play around some more with the "SuperSE." This thing is loaded with old software and files... I'll have to make a backup and make sure none are missing from Macintosh Garden/Macintosh Repository/etc.

There is some slight screen burn-in on the SE. But the display seems to be fairly crisp otherwise.

The Kensington System Saver, as I mention (but you can't really hear) in the video in my post above, is a little on the loud side. It makes an ominous rattling/rumbling sound after it gets going for a couple minutes, then it quits and is pretty quiet.

Files present on the machine give the impression it was used from 1988 to 1995/96.

Edit: Does anyone know how to permanently disable/remove the password extension thing? I'd like for it to boot normally with all extensions, but don't know the password. They had top-notch security back in the day... almost reminds me of the locked gates that have a giant space next to them that allow you to fit your hand through to unlock and enter.

Click to expand...

if it's an extension or control panel, can't you just locate the suspect file after booting without extensions and then drop it in the trash?

What Matt said, but usually my MO is this: when I get a machine with a working HD, I connect it somehow via network or external SCSI to another drive. I then make a DiskCopy image of the entire HD. I then proceed to reformat the entire thing and install a fresh system on a blank HD. At my leasure, I can then peruse the old stuff and reintroduce things if I wish.

Sorry for the double post. Found out this thing has a Mobius 030 accelerator card with a Motorola 68030 processor... bringing it on-par with the SE/30 spec-wise. Apparently there's also the option to add an external monitor to this thing, which may be what the port on the back is for. Anyone know if you can get an adapter for it, or do you need one of the special Mobius monitors?

The floppy drive is really crusty... it's filled with lots of dust. (Just a standard 800k drive.) I'm about to plug in my FloppyEmu to do a backup (this time I'm going to ask the original owner if he may want his files just as a keepsake.) There are LOTS of files and software, so it's probably going to take a while. The original owner must've kept programming, as this thing has ThinkC installed with a couple sample software written in C that I can't get to work. He (or someone else in his family who used this machine, as different name but same last name) must've been into music, because there are tons of music papers and a dissertation on here.

My goal for this machine is to test System 7 on it and maybe, just maybe, get QuickTime and Arnold's MIDI Player running. The former is definitely possible (I was running System 7.1 on my Classic just a couple days ago) but the later may be a slight stretch, since my only experience with AMP is in Basilisk II emulating a Quadra 950 '040 with 128 MB RAM. This thing has a '030 with 16 MB RAM.

Questions on the SE:

1. Any tips for disassembling this thing, or at least removing the logic board without breaking anything? I got the HD and floppy connectors disconnected, but couldn't really reach the main power connector to unplug it. My hand kept touching the neck board and I was super afraid I may accidentally hit it, damaging (destroying) the CRT. Then there's the accelerator card, which seems to be a tight fit - along with the ribbon cable going to that port on the rear.
   

As for the PowerBook 165, does anyone know where I can find a power supply to use it with? The hinge on it is pretty crusty as well, and PowerBook 1xx models worry me because they're notorious for having hinges, plastics, and displays that fail. Any tips for keeping it in decent condition, besides the obvious "lock it in a cabinet and only look at it when you absolutely have to" reply?

Also TIL the PowerBook 165 uses the Motorola 68030. I thought the entire PowerBook 1xx line used the 68000, but I'm guessing I was dead wrong. I'm not super familiar with the PowerBooks as laptops are not my thing, although in my situation they're nice because they take up less space and are portable. (But difficult to work on and really easy to damage.)

I would've never guessed this SE had a '030 accelerator card and so much installed in it. Crazy...

mattsoft said:

if it's an extension or control panel, can't you just locate the suspect file after booting without extensions and then drop it in the trash?

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Problem right now is trying to locate the specific extension. (I've looked in the control panel and I couldn't find anything relating to passwords.) The only thing I could find that might possibly relate is "Finder(keys)" that was located in the system folder.

Re: disassembly - yes, indeed, the logic board to analog board connector can be fraught with danger due to the proximity to the CRT neck. In my opinion, you are actually safer taking the neck board off if unsure because 1. It makes the clearance greater, and 2. It takes away a source of a 90 degree sheer force on the back of the CRT. With time, you will develop your own technique to pull it without damage. As for the card, id remove the daughter board (with the monitor connector) and it’s ribbon or whatever connects it first. Then, you should be able to slide out the logic board and the accelerator (I assume

it sits right on top of the logic board). One note: these logic boards don’t slide out like the Plus. They slide out maybe an inch, and then if you look at the frame, one side of rails the board slides on is keyed: indentations that match up with indentations on the logic board perfectly if it is lined up right. Once they are lined up, swing the logic board out from the keyed side and it should pull out entirely. One note: once you swing it out a Little, you will likely feel resistance. That is the speaker audio cable still connected. Be sure to detach this prior to swinging the board all the way out, or you could bend the pins on the male logic board jack.

As did the floppy drive, I’ve got a video guide you can use:

LaPorta said:

Re: disassembly - yes, indeed, the logic board to analog board connector can be fraught with danger due to the proximity to the CRT neck. In my opinion, you are actually safer taking the neck board off if unsure because 1. It makes the clearance greater, and 2. It takes away a source of a 90 degree sheer force on the back of the CRT. With time, you will develop your own technique to pull it without damage. As for the card, id remove the daughter board (with the monitor connector) and it’s ribbon or whatever connects it first. Then, you should be able to slide out the logic board and the accelerator (I assume

it sits right on top of the logic board). One note: these logic boards don’t slide out like the Plus. They slide out maybe an inch, and then if you look at the frame, one side of rails the board slides on is keyed: indentations that match up with indentations on the logic board perfectly if it is lined up right. Once they are lined up, swing the logic board out from the keyed side and it should pull out entirely. One note: once you swing it out a Little, you will likely feel resistance. That is the speaker audio cable still connected. Be sure to detach this prior to swinging the board all the way out, or you could bend the pins on the male logic board jack.

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I've spent the past four hours typing the post for my blog on the SuperSE, so I'm sorry for the delayed reply. 

I will remember to remove the neck board (and obviously discharge the CRT prior to that) when servicing.

I learned the hard way on how these SE logic boards slide out... with my other SE I pulled out like on my Classic, and bent the speaker connectors. (It's fine, it bent back into shape and works fine.) I actually like that design and how it conveniently flips out for servicing. However, this one doesn't want to slide up enough for it to clear the rail... it actually doesn't really want to move far. But that may be caused by the power connector.

Yes. You can barely budge the board unless the connector is out of the way.

LaPorta said:

Yes. You can barely budge the board unless the connector is out of the way.

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That makes sense. At some point I'll discharge the CRT and pull the neck board off to remove that connector and pull the logic board out.

The post is online, in case anyone is interested. It took me about 4 hours to write, but I got it done. Today feels like I'm in a time paradox as every time I looked at the clock a couple hours had passed.  :lol:  http://personal.garrettfuller.org/blog/2021/01/22/introducing-the-macintosh-se-superse-powerbook-165/

As mentioned in my "Duo 270c: Yay or nay?" post, I made the 70-mile journey to Overland Park, KS yesterday to pick up this PowerBook Duo 270c. It came with the power supply and a battery, but nothing else - unfortunately, no docking station. It appears to be in pretty good condition, but I haven't looked at it too terribly much (I was exhausted yesterday after returning, and have a lot to do today and these next couple days.) As per everyone's advice, I'm not going to attempt to power it on until I have it recapped due to the supposed risk of shorts that can fry some 5 volt components.

I try to do "introduction" posts on my blog about all of my finds, but this one will probably have to wait. My followers on Twitter (and the people reading this and my 270c post, obviously) know that I've picked it up.



My 68030 machines now outnumber my 68000 machines... 3-2.

On a slightly unrelated note, in OPKS we passed right by Micro Center, which is essentially the Midwestern equivalent to Fry's Electronics. I decided to stop in and look around, and I'm glad I did. Here in Mid-Missouri, computer parts stores are very scarce - unless you count Best Buy. Micro Center had almost anything people working on computers or electronics would need - soldering irons, oscilloscopes, a wide selection of Raspberry Pi and Arduino modules, and even arcade cabinet kits. Of course they sell computers, but also a wide selection of computer parts. As I posted on Twitter: "I felt like I died and landed in geek heaven." I picked up a ESD grounding wrist strap (something I've been needing) but should've picked up more... at least a multimeter. Oh well. It took us about 30 minutes to wait for check out, as the store was extremely busy and the line stretched all the way to the back of the store. I may go back, hopefully on a less busy day.


P.S. - Happy birthday to the Macintosh... 37 years.

@Garrett We had a Micro Center in Northern California just before the real estate crash.  There's still one in Southern California.  They were different from Fry's.  Fry's had a bunch of, well, crap in addition to computer stuff.  They also had an electronics component section that, while overpriced, was occasionally useful.

Micro Center, on the other hand, is an absolutely fantastic store to build custom PCs.  I dearly miss them.  They have the absolute best deals around, especially their CPU + motherboard combo deals.   Usually got either a heavily discounted or sometimes even free motherboard with the purchase of a bundled CPU.  They were all in-store only, of course, to drive traffic there, but I didn't mind.  Beat the pants off anything you could buy online.

For the brief time they were in my area, I was able to match or beat custom PC sales people on Craigslist and elsewhere, and I didn't have to violate any TOS agreements with Microsoft, Intel, nVidia, and AMD to do it.  My brother and I had done pretty well building custom PCs for a few years.  It was fun, and a great side hustle to my regular job.

olePigeon said:

Micro Center, on the other hand, is an absolutely fantastic store to build custom PCs.  I dearly miss them.  They have the absolute best deals around, especially their CPU + motherboard combo deals.   Usually got either a heavily discounted or sometimes even free motherboard with the purchase of a bundled CPU.  They were all in-store only, of course, to drive traffic there, but I didn't mind.  Beat the pants off anything you could buy online.

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Amen to all of that.  I've got two that are "reasonably" close to me but when I lived within 3 miles of one of them that was seriously dangerous.  Every TV in my house ended up with an HTPC attached to it because of how close I lived to that Micro Center.  Even back in my CC days we'd always (quietly) recommend going there for accessories and whatnot since they didn't charge an arm and a leg for cables, adapters, etc.

Garrett said:

I may go back, hopefully on a less busy day.

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I wish you the best of luck on that endeavor.  If yours is anything like either of mine it's rare when they're not busy.

I went with a friend (I loathe driving in big cities) so I didn't want to stay too long to avoid boring her. Interestingly, she told me she is good at soldering and has done some light programming work with Arduinos. I was shocked to see how busy it was, and to see the diversity in people there. I was thinking the only people there would be "geeks" like myself, but that wasn't the case.

If I went by myself, I probably would've got lost in there for hours. The prices on everything was pretty reasonable. Online I took a look at their processor/motherboard combos and they are super cheap. I definitely know where to go if I ever want to build my own computer and have one nearby. Unfortunately, the one in OPKS is the closest one (~60+ mile drive) and the only other one in MO is in St. Louis.

Returning to my Macs, I'm now trying to find a way to make a backup of the SuperSE files. Since the SE has the 030 accelerator installed, I can't use the FloppyEmu in HD20 emulation mode. I tried using AppleTalk file sharing with my Classic as the "host" (System 7.1) but the SuperSE (System 6.0.5) doesn't "see" it, even with AppleTalk active. Will I need to buy a SCSI-2-SD to transfer files with the SuperSE?

Garrett said:

Returning to my Macs, I'm now trying to find a way to make a backup of the SuperSE files. Since the SE has the 030 accelerator installed, I can't use the FloppyEmu in HD20 emulation mode. I tried using AppleTalk file sharing with my Classic as the "host" (System 7.1) but the SuperSE (System 6.0.5) doesn't "see" it, even with AppleTalk active. Will I need to buy a SCSI-2-SD to transfer files with the SuperSE?

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Any kind of external SCSI HD or Zip drive?

If it's too big to fit on one floppy, there's one of the file compression utilities that can break archives up into floppy sized chunks, and then re-assembles them when you extract. I just can't remember the name right now! :-(

Interesting that the SE doesn't see the classic server. I networked my SE back when I had it on 6.0.8 with a 7.1 and 7.5.3 mac without issues. I presume you managed to network your other macs before without issue, right? In order to rule out that as a problem.

What port did you use? Modem or Printer port, to connect them?

What sort of cabling are you using between the two?

BacioiuC said:

Interesting that the SE doesn't see the classic server. I networked my SE back when I had it on 6.0.8 with a 7.1 and 7.5.3 mac without issues. I presume you managed to network your other macs before without issue, right? In order to rule out that as a problem.

What port did you use? Modem or Printer port, to connect them?

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On both, I believe I used the printer port on both machines. The Classic was the machine being used as the host, so that I could transfer files from the SE to the Classic and onto a folder in the FloppyEmu. (The Classic booted into System 7.1 from the FloppyEmu.)

LaPorta said:

What sort of cabling are you using between the two?

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Just a standard Apple serial cable. Even has the little Apple logo on the ends.

I visited the Micro Center when I was in SoCal a few years ago (2017), and it was FUN!

I got some parts for the file server I was building at the time (cables, drives, etc), and I picked up a souvenir Micro Center-branded flash drive which I still use (since it's 64 GB at USB 3.0 speeds, it's one of the fastest ones I have).  Also picked up a nice little keyboard (sorta like the numpad-less Apple Keyboard, but not).

I'm going to have to go back to SoCal at some point once the pandemic's over for some important business, so maybe while I'm there I can go back and have another look around!

c

*Separate post for clarity*

Regarding serial cables, doesn't one need a special crossover cable for direct machine-to-machine LocalTalk?

c

CC_333 said:

I got some parts for the file server I was building at the time (cables, drives, etc), and I picked up a souvenir Micro Center-branded flash drive which I still use (since it's 64 GB at USB 3.0 speeds, it's one of the fastest ones I have).  Also picked up a nice little keyboard (sorta like the numpad-less Apple Keyboard, but not).

Click to expand...

My "file server" back at home currently only has 290 GB of storage - a 250 GB hard drive for storage, and 40 GB drive for Linux Mint. When I get my own place, I plan on either upgrading that server or building a completely new one from the ground up. The hard drives I saw at Micro Center were really decently priced, and I was contemplating buying a drive right there. But I currently don't have a use for that server because its at home and I can't (easily) connect it to our WiFi and use it as a network server of sorts.

250 GB is nothing.

CC_333 said:

Regarding serial cables, doesn't one need a special crossover cable for direct machine-to-machine LocalTalk?

Click to expand...

AppleTalk, LocalTalk, etc. is still slightly confusing to me, even after reading about it. I thought you could directly connect two machines together and have them talk to each other, but I guess not? I knew you needed a special dongle to be able to use AppleTalk/LocalTalk for larger networks, modems, etc.

I might buy a SCSI-2-SD at some point for the SuperSE... not sure if I should go for an internal one and replace the old, loud Maxtor hard drive (which seems to work fine, and I like because of the noise) or an external one that simply plugs into the back of the machine. 

I'm about to post a "WTB" for a power supply for the PowerBook 165. I'm not sure if the PB 165 will even power on... the original owner who gave the machines to me said they hadn't been powered on in over a decade. With that said, is there an easy way to extract the battery from the PB 165? The door on the front left side of the machine slides forward a little bit, but doesn't want to slide all the way off or come off. Is that normal? I don't want to break anything so I stopped while I was ahead.