SuperDuoHack Brainstorming Session =8-D

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

. . . it would be a sin to cut up one of those to stuff in a Duo carcass. It's less than half an inch thick, for crying out loud! It'd be like cutting up a Lotus Elise to re-engine your old Yugo. :^b

YUGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! How dare you?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
. . . think MG-TD Roadster! The Duo factor will NEVER sink THAT low!

The one other option you could consider, if you can yield on the aspect ratio issue in favor of more pixels, is that there are/were a number of 1280x768 or 1366x768 "widescreen" laptops that had 10.6 to 11.1 inch displays. The Sony Vaio TX series is one, but it looks like at least Asus, Fujitsu, and Averatec had similar models. The Viao is 10.7" inches wide, so *hypothetically* you might get that screen into the Duo lid with more room to spare than the full-height Thinkpad one. The vertical dimension would probably be about the same as the original screen.

Widescreen at a MINIMUM of a full 768 pixels high is no problem at all! It's a FEATURE! I'll do anything necessary to have a Duo's plastics enfold ANY sized donor that'll kick some NetBook@$$, however "current cool" the design! I'd pick a retro-cool look over that ANY day of the week.

My only regret is that there are no transportable computers with the factor of "Mid Century Modern Design" as candidates for hacking!

Of course, what comes around with any of these is once you get your hands on one will you really want to ruin it by stuffing it into a PowerBook Duo's case plastics? ;^) These are all thinner and lighter and sexier than your target chassis. I know you've expressed a preference for a trackball over a trackpad, but doesn't the 2300c (and that's what I've gotten the impression you have) have a trackpad anyway?

As I said, bite your tongue, you pointy toothed carnosaur! The Duo/DuoDock/Mini/MicroDock system's factor is timeless!

IIRC, I've got every version of Duo extant, and I'm ready to use the thinner grayscale lid at the drop of a hat. However, if necessary, I'll use the color lid to allow for any additional reinforcement necessary!

It's time to kick some NetBook Butt! . . . as soon as I can save up the $!

[Gorgonops]

. . . it would be a sin to cut up one of those to stuff in a Duo carcass. It's less than half an inch thick, for crying out loud! It'd be like cutting up a Lotus Elise to re-engine your old Yugo. :^b

YUGO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! How dare you?!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
. . . think MG-TD Roadster! The Duo factor will NEVER sink THAT low!

"The MG TD is a standard transmission, rear-wheel-drive roadster. It represents the state-of-the-art in engine design, transmission, and suspension... for 1952. Which means, what? The engine breaks frequently, it leaks oil almost as fast as it burns gas, and it handles only marginally better than a bathtub."

Given the quality of Apple's engineering in the mid-90's... sure, I'll go with that as an apt comparison for the PowerBook Duo 2300c. ;^)

Widescreen at a MINIMUM of a full 768 pixels high is no problem at all! It's a FEATURE! I'll do anything necessary to have a Duo's plastics enfold ANY sized donor that'll kick some NetBook@$$, however "current cool" the design! I'd pick a retro-cool look over that ANY day of the week.

My only regret is that there are no transportable computers with the factor of "Mid Century Modern Design" as candidates for hacking!

Personally I think the Compaq Portable III is a nice piece of work, as is the Morrow Pivot, but I don't think I'd have the heart to seriously hack either one, at least if it were in complete working condition. (Although the Pivot *would* be a great candidate for a widescreen LCD...)

In any case, I stumbled across a shopping site that conveniently orders laptops by screen size. Here's a link to the "11 inch" category. Everything in "10 inch" is either an Atom netbook or an *incredibly expensive* Panasonic Toughbook. (Note I've never ordered anything from these guys so I'm not recommending them in any way, but the list is useful for finding "currently being manufactured" candidates.) From what I see there the Vaio "TT" series, Lenovo IdeaPad U110, or a couple Asus models with 11.1 inch screens are the only things with both Core Duo CPUs and horizontal dimensions less than a 2300c. There are some 8.9 inch tablet machines that would also certainly fit, but the screen would be smaller than the hole in the current bezel.

All these things sell for some pretty serious scratch. (two grand ballpark) I admire your intestinal fortitude if you really go through with buying one of these just to cut it apart.

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Given the quality of Apple's engineering in the mid-90's... sure, I'll go with that as an apt comparison for the PowerBook Duo 2300c. ;^)

[/quote]

ROTFLMAO!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I couldn't agree more, but TDs were undeniably fun to drive (except for old windbags that're prone to hyperbole) and had a factor far beyond that of my brother's Miata or any current, plastic bumpered wonder (with the possible exception of the new VW Beetle Convertible, in which one can spread one's legs far enough apart for comfort, avoid pain in, a/o flattening of, a certain pair of rounded sections of the male anatomy) despite any Leyland product's obvious shortcomings.

Besides, NOBODY actually buys a British Sports car to drive it . . . . . . they buy one to "mother" it!

Personally I think the Compaq Portable III is a nice piece of work, as is the Morrow Pivot, but I don't think I'd have the heart to seriously hack either one, at least if it were in complete working condition. (Although the Pivot *would* be a great candidate for a widescreen LCD...)

HEH! I'm ALREADY well into seriously hacking a Compaq Portable II as a luggable peripheral for HP_Mini! There'll even be room for some microscopic mobo one day, but for now, it'll be my internet coffee-house conversation hack! And it'll make surfing with a NetBook a far less limiting, a much more comfortable, and remarkably more efficient experience!

Don't worry, I found it sitting on top of a garbage can outside a thrift shop down here about four years ago, it was down and out for the count!

I've also got a slotted Toshiba Portable awaiting the teeth of the Ryoba!

[Mac128]

I know you've expressed a preference for a trackball over a trackpad, but doesn't the 2300c (and that's what I've gotten the impression you have) have a trackpad anyway?

Yes it did, but the beauty of the 2300 was that it was a hybrid machine. A blessing and a curse when it came to the CPU and bus architecture. But, it used the exact same ADB connector that the trackball did. In fact Powerbookguy.com at my encouragement sold a trackball retrograde kit which consisted of a 280c case top with a trackball assembly. All you did was remover the trackpad and replace it with the new lid and trackball which even used the same mounting screws.

I'll do anything necessary to have a Duo's plastics enfold ANY sized donor that'll kick some NetBook@$$, however "current cool" the design! I'd pick a retro-cool look over that ANY day of the week. ... The Duo/DuoDock/Mini/MicroDock system's factor is timeless!

I couldn't agree more. I have almost the entire collection of them and a variety of their docks (both Apple and third-party).The design of the whole and its parts has yet to be equalled. Apple's only failing with the Duo was that they intentionally crippled it to prevent it from competing with the desktops. There was absolutely nothing like it on the market at the time or since. Everything about the system was so elegant. The cheap PC port replicators that pass for docking solutions then and today are a pale and pathetic imitator of what the Duo offered. The closest suggestion I have seen since was the rumored iMac form factor which was a screen that allowed a stripped-down, MacBook Air-type notebook to be slid into the side of it, turning it into a full desktop. The current 24" LCD screen is not a bad solution, but does nothing for the MacBook Air, which would be the whole point in my estimation ... plus it is not big enough. Now this new tablet that is rumored to be coming ... that holds massive potential for a dockable Duo form factor. In fact I'd like to stuff that into a Duo case!

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

[Bunsen]

Personally I think the Compaq Portable III is a nice piece of work / but I don't think I'd have the heart to seriously hack

Can, and will

the Morrow Pivot

Now that is gorgeous.

[Osgeld]

looks like a toaster oven, like you could peer into that window and see if your tv dinner is ready or not

[Bunsen]

Duo 2300c is listed on Everymac as:

10.9" x 8.5" x 1.5"

Powerbook G4 12"
10.9" x 8.6" x 1.18"

Now I know it doesn't meet your spec, jt, and that extra 0.1" could be tricky (lose the optical, rearrange stuff?) but still .... hmmm.

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

OSX!!!!!! PTUI!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! ubuntuCentricity ONLY!!!!!!

[Bunsen]

Who said it had to run OS X?

[Bunsen]

Toshiba Portege A600

1.4GHz Core2Duo, 12.1" WXGA

Dimensions: 286mm(W) x 223mm(D) x 29.9mm(H)
= 11.3" x 8.8" x 1.2"

A little too large without some serious rearrangement, but way cheaper than a Vaio

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Width may not be a problem!

For now, all my $ is spoken for, so I think I'll start watching for an appropriate display/cable housed within a far less capable (used/eBay sourced) donor.

That way I can begin the lid reconstruction/re-design/width increase.

How does a WidescreenPowerBookDuo2Hack™, equipped with a 1400's KBD/hacked w/Numeric a/o Function keypad extension & polished metal insert midsection/extension cribbed from the Pismo hacks strike you?

Think: extra width trade-off = real KBD/metric crapload of wide@$$ formatted pixels & DVD player capability!

I've already got tentative plans for a DuoDockStretchHack™!

Whatcha think, gang?

[Bunsen]

an appropriate display/cable housed within a / donor.

You get that laptop LCDs and cables are not just swap'n'go between models, right?

1400's KBD/hacked w/Numeric a/o Function keypad extension

Just how wide are you planning to make this thing?

The 1400 keyboard is not even ADB, just a bare keymatrix. The ADB IC is on the 1400 logicboard.
Oh wait, that's a good thing

[Bunsen]

Duo 2300c is listed on Everymac as:

10.9" x 8.5" x 1.5"

Here, let me standardize that for you:

277mm x 216mm x 38mm

On that basis, here's another candidate panel for you

Display Area 10.4-inch diagonal
Number of Pixels 1024 × 768
Module Size 236 × 174.3 × 7.4mm

Although that specific listing doesn't say so, the seller offers an AV/VGA input board on other panels for an extra $35. His store also conveniently lists all his panels by size, in one inch increments. You may find other candidates there, in the 11" and 12" categories. I looked in the 8" and couldn't find anything over 800x600.

/ETA/ Thought of another name for the project: The Nuo

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

I saw my first 12" (nominal) NetBook today and I'm seriously smitten!


http://eeepc.asus.com/global/product1101ha.html
According to their pre-sales tech support, it can be upgraded to 2 MB of RAM!

They blew the KBD design, it's almost identical to the Duo's. If they had made it almost edge to edge, like their 10.1" model, it would have been almost Full Sized!

When I save up the $ and the "perfect" 12" NetBook is released, I'm going to grab one!
I'll give you just ONE GUESS where HP_Mini is headed right after I set up ubuntu on the 12" Netbook!

[Bunsen]

Still an Atom CPU. But yes, very nice looking. Personally I think I'm in love with the Toshiba Portege A600 I linked above. Core2Duo, mmmmMMmmm

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Still an Atom CPU. But yes, very nice looking. Personally I think I'm in love with the Toshiba Portege A600 I linked above. Core2Duo, mmmmMMmmm

Yep! The one you like is nice, but I'm on a tight budget, for now, and I'm trying to stay within the NetBook/Duo continuum.

I'm waiting to research the "best" 12" NetBook, it's only the screen's full 786 high pixelcount that made me fall in love!

[Gorgonops]

I saw my first 12" (nominal) NetBook today and I'm seriously smitten!

(snip)

According to their pre-sales tech support, it can be upgraded to 2 MB of RAM!

They blew the KBD design, it's almost identical to the Duo's. If they had made it almost edge to edge, like their 10.1" model, it would have been almost Full Sized!

When I save up the $ and the "perfect" 12" NetBook is released, I'm going to grab one!
I'll give you just ONE GUESS where HP_Mini is headed right after I set up ubuntu on the 12" Netbook!

There are a couple rather bad things about this unit.

1: Any netbook equipped with the Intel GMA 500 graphics processor (which this one is) is a sketchy choice for running Linux on. Google "GMA 500 Linux" and read up on it. Basically, the GMA 500 isn't at all related to the GMA 900/950/3100/et al cores used on most Intel chipsets, but instead is a hackjob licensed from PowerVR using *completely different* drivers that are neither completely open source nor integrated with the main Xorg source trees. The ubuntu "Netbook Remix" package does currently support GMA 500, but people are having constant issues with it if they step outside the lines *at all*. You're very likely to have problems if you, for instance, intend to drive an external monitor with it, and you may also find support seriously lagging when it comes time to upgrade.

2. The Atom 520N CPU is substantially slower than the A270 used in the first-round netbooks. (HP Mini, etc.) That combined with the bad graphics engine makes this machine "pretty darn slow". (Think "stuttering on YouTube" slow. Even under Windows.)

The screen and form factor are certainly nice. I drooled over this unit, or at least one of its twins, last time I went to Costco, but given the driver headaches and disappointing performance I've gotten out of my current "sexier then a plain Netbook-Netbook" (an HP 2133) I decided I'd been there, done that, and got the tee shirt already.

If you're on a budget really your best choice is to say "screw it" and get a 13 inch "Pentium Dual-Core"/Core Duo 2 machine (Or possibly one of those dual-core AMD systems, for that matter) and just do it right. The extra inch and two pounds of weight gets you a *lot* more computer for the dollar than either a Netbook or a super-sexy high-end ultraportable. (I've seen 13 inch dual-core laptops for less then $500 on sale, and these are units with 2-4GB of RAM and 300+ GB hard disks. It's no contest compared to a Netbook if you don't mind an extra pound or two of flab... which ironically is still in the same weight class as a Duo anyway.)

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

There are a couple rather bad things about this unit.

I'm not even considering this unit, it's the screen and its 768 vertical pixels that I love. I'll be waiting until the best of the 12" NetBooks (for running ubuntu) is released and the bugs are worked out before buying one.

If you're on a budget really your best choice is to say "screw it" and get a 13 inch "Pentium Dual-Core"/Core Duo 2 machine /... which ironically is still in the same weight class as a Duo anyway.)

I'm looking to keep the weight of the entire bag down to the 5 lb. +- weight of the Duo's carcass.

I can't wait to start hacking HP_Mini into a Duo's carcass!

. . . but I will.

[Bunsen]

http://gizmodo.com/5407955/super-cheap- ... 100e-leaks

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

http://gizmodo.com/5407955/super-cheap-super-small-lenovo-x100e-leaks

Sweet vaporware! I'll be watching that closely!

thx,

[Gorgonops]

I'm not even considering this unit, it's the screen and its 768 vertical pixels that I love. I'll be waiting until the best of the 12" NetBooks (for running ubuntu) is released and the bugs are worked out before buying one.

<snip>

I'm looking to keep the weight of the entire bag down to the 5 lb. +- weight of the Duo's carcass.

I'm confused again... did you like the Asus because of the "whole package" and wanting to use it as such, or just for the screen as part of the mythic Duo hacking exercise? Every "11.6"-inch laptop I saw whilst looking was wider than a Duo 2300c. (11 inches plus, vs the 10.9 of the Duo. That specific Asus is listed as "11.3") Given how skinny the screen bezel is on the Asus the panel is *not* fitting in the Duo lid. Which I suppose means if you were serious about cutting the duo in half and stretching it with an insert you could do it, but... the question "why?" starts seriously raging in ones' ears. There are 10-11.1 inch panels with that resolution that would fit much more easily.

(Look at the Sony Vaio W series for instance. 10.1 inch 1366x768 is standard. For that matter the HP Mini 110 also offers a 10.1 inch 1366x768 panel option. According to HP's online store it costs a whopping $35 over the base price, meaning you could get Intel GMA 950 Netbook guts and a high res screen for $334 if Netbook-class CPU power is what you want.)

It seems like you've expressed a desire for more CPU power than an Atom, but if you're willing to settle you can get your hacking fodder for less then $350 shipped. If you really want to go whole-hog and make a matching Duo-Dock there is now an experimental Linux driver for Displaylink video cards, so simply by routing a USB port in place of the dock connector you should be able to duplicate everything a Duo dock does with the guts of a powered USB hub and a few widgets. (Displaylink video cards can be had for less than $60. Add a USB hard drive adapter and creatively stretch the floppy slot to accommodate a slot-loading DVD drive and you'll have a pretty complete and functioning Duo-doppelganger. Software setup will be a little tricky, I'll grant.)

Just a thought, anyway, if you really want to get this thing out of the "dreaming" stage and actually start cutting plastic.

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

You're reading too much into it, my old friend!

I'm MUCH impressed with the next step up in LCD size for NetBooks, the possibility of room for a full KBD, room for six cell bats and a weight tradeoff of just about one pound, which I can live with!

I've decided to wait for the "closest to perfect for the $," 12" NetBook with unquestionable ubuntu compatibility, while I save up my pennies for the purchase.

. . . and then HP_Mini will be parted out, becoming the new innards for one of my Duos . . .
. . . preferably my very first (used of course) Duo 230!

pre - p.s. (?) you made it clear the situation was third down & waaay too far for a field goal . . . so I punted!

[Gorgonops]

Aaaah. Okay, then. ;^)

The HP Mini 311 might be worth a look. It has the new Nvidia ION chipset and the same 11.6 panel as that Asus. Of course, there's a long thread on the Ubuntu support forum that sort of reads like people have been having hit-and-miss luck with it. Unfortunately Linux tends to be that way on the bleeding edge.

[Trash80toHP_Mini]

Big_Mini = Love at first sight!

Now back to pinching pennies . . .

Trash80toBIGuntuMini?