Powerbook G4 1.67, 17 not booting

[spiceyokooko]

I acquired another Powerbook G4, 1.67, 17 inch laptop (I have three now!) but this one doesn't seem to want to boot.

I have tried a few things to get it booting but nothing seems to be working. I wanted to see if anyone had any thoughts as to what might be causing the problem before I start dismantling it and swopping parts over - not something I really want to do if I can avoid it.

So here's what's happening -

When I press the power on button for a couple of seconds I get the startup bong and the drive spins up, fan comes on and I go to the grey screen. That then stays grey for some time, several minutes before flashing to a black screen and then back to grey and a flashing question mark in a folder icon. The keyboard does not respond to any input commands - regardless of what keyboard button I press it makes no difference - I still get the same thing. I can't reset the PRAM, I cannot boot into verbose mode.

If I reset the PMU by holding down the power button for 6 seconds I get a long beep and a few flashing lights on the sleep indicator. This is not a short beep it's one long beeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeep. It then carries on as above including startup bong.

It won't boot from an install DVD - all I get is the same as above. The install DVD is known to be good and working.

The next step I think is to start checking cables, RAM and connections, but any thoughts welcomed.

Cheers!

[ClassicHasClass]

Can you get into OpenFirmware?

[spiceyokooko]

Yes, I can get into open firmware by pressing command-option F O, but after re-setting the NVRAM, it simply goes back to a flashing question mark in a folder icon again!

Any more thoughts?

Cheers!

[bibilit]

Can be a lot of things :

Bad HD (can you try target mode ? i suppose you cannot as the keyboard is not responding) i don't know how hard is removing the HD from those !!

Bad HD connecting cable

The thing is you advise the keyboard is not responding but you managed to get into open firmware !!

Holding the ALT key pressed down should give you the available booting devices... can you try ?

Bad DVD drive

As you have several to play with, try swapping parts.

[spiceyokooko]

bibilit, thanks for your thoughts.

I was hoping that someone might have an easy answer without my having to put in the hard slog of working out what the problem is!

Initially, the keyboard would not respond to any keyboard input. Eg, it will not reject the CD by holding down the eject button, or holding down the F12 key or holding down the trackpad click button. It will not boot from CD/DVD by holding down the C key, nor will it enter target disk mode by holding down the T key nor will it enter verbose by holding down the shift key.

It was only after classic suggested entering open firmware that I was able to achieve this.

I've reset the NVRAM from open firmware - makes no difference, it still comes up with a flashing question mark. I've checked if it's seeing the HD by entering <devalias hd> and it returned the correct line - hd /pci@f4000000/@d/mac-io@7/ata-4@1f000/disk@0 so it's seeing the hard disk.

So it sees the HD but it won't boot from it, neither will it boot from DVD.

Holding down the alt key brings up two icons a roundish one and an arrow, but all I get is the old watch with the hands going round and it just stays like that.

I've checked and re-seated the RAM, I've tried with only one stick of RAM in the main slot, none of it makes any difference I still get the flashing question mark.

I'm now out of ideas apart from basically dismantling the laptop and checking all the connections.

Any more thoughts?

e2a I cant even get it to eject the System DVD from within open firmware by typing > eject cd, it just says cant OPEN the EJECT device!

[bibilit]

e2a I cant even get it to eject the System DVD from within open firmware by typing > eject cd, it just says cant OPEN the EJECT device!

Maybe the CD drive is gone bad and the PWB is unable to boot from the HD... or maybe something else in the process is not working properly and you don't go nowhere.

I will try with another CD drive first, and with a different install DVD (or CD) if available... just to be sure.

[spiceyokooko]

Just tried that - swopped in a known working DVD and known working System Disk - same problem!

Flashing question mark in a folder icon.

Next I'll swop over the HD's.

[spiceyokooko]

Well I've ascertained a couple of things -

1/ The DVD drive in the laptop is working fine.
2/ The hard disk won't boot in my other machine.
3/ The good known working HD won't boot the laptop either.

So why won't the laptop boot off the known working DVD drive?

[ClassicHasClass]

I'm wondering about the controller.

[bibilit]

i will try a clean install of the non booting HDD with a working Powerbook, is the connecting cable OK ??

[spiceyokooko]

i will try a clean install of the non booting HDD with a working Powerbook, is the connecting cable OK ??

I wish I could!

When I put the HD from the non-working Powerbook into the working one, it wouldn't boot it.

But I didn't use the cable from the working HD, I'll try that next.

Cheers!

[spiceyokooko]

Okay, we're getting somewhere.

Swopped back in the working HD with its cable - and that's booted the machine.

Just need to figure out whether it's the cable or the HD now.

Cheers!

e2A Yet now it won't see the DVD drive!

Swopped in the known working one and now it won't boot again.

Anyone got any theories as to what's causing this?

[spiceyokooko]

Okay just to update on this.

After a lot of fiddling around moving bits between the laptops trying to figure out what's what, the upshot is that the hard drive in the Powerbook is knackered.

Not sure why it wasn't seeing the DVD drive, can only assume a bad connection, because it's now seeing it okay, but still won't recognise the hard disk. However, when the HD is swopped in from the working Powerbook, it boots the machine fine. Only conclusion can be then, that it needs a new hard drive.

Many thanks to all those who contributed.

[mcdermd]

For future - what did a verbose boot show? Did you ever try booting from an external Firewire drive to cut out the ATA bus?

[spiceyokooko]

I'm not sure I ever did boot it in verbose mode to be honest. I did run AHT on it, once it started seeing the DVD drive but it passed all those tests okay.

I didn't try booting it from a firewire drive for the simple reason that I don't have one, only a USB external drive, but since this problem I do intend to get a firewire drive and try exactly that.

I've ordered a new hard drive for it. I'm actually going to upgrade my main Powerbook G4 to a 160Gb drive and put the old one from this one into the one that needs the new drive. Ultimately I hope to have two identical running Powerbook G4, 1.67's, one as a main machine and one as a backup machine should anything happen to the first one.

Once the new hard drive arrives I'll boot the faulty machine in verbose mode and see what it says and try it from the external firewire drive when I get one.

Cheers!